discussion   |   photos   |   email   |   myProfile   |   home          Login Now | Sign Up


Forum Index


New As Posted | Active Subjects



Click to Post a New Message!

Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > Alternate Electric Energy Forum

Page [ 1 ] |
Reply | Pop Up Window Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo
 03-04-2004, 00:46 Post: 78721
JParker

TP Contributor

View my Photos

View my Photos  Pics
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Richmond, VA
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 152

Return to Full
 Geothermal heating cooling

I'm surprized Ken wasn't taking bets on how long before I put my $0.02 in on this one.

I have designed a decent number of geothermal systems, but will admit to rather limited experience with horizontal installations. What I have seen, read in the trade, and learned from trying to help Ken strongly suggests sticking with known, independently tested ground exchanger designs.

Ken's contractor had a home brewed concept with no 3rd party test data to check it against. I think Ken got short changed, but can't prove it. It also seems like the unit may be a little small for the house and climate. Recovery time is a function of unit size vs. load.

Add some hardware issues with what was a new technology at the time (2 speed compressors) and I don't blame him for being bitter. I really would have hoped Waterfurnace would have stepped up to the plate on the equipment side, but apparently they haven't.

It's a lot like the discussions we keep coming back to here about tractors and dealers. Usually any of the name brand machines are fine to own, but having a good dealer and in this case a good installer very important.

If you have the room to go horizontal, be sure to spread it out, get it all in as deep as possible and limit the number pipes in one trench. The whole concept is transferring heat to and from the earth, so keep the pipes away from each other. If you can do your own trenching, I wouldn't even consider any more than a 2 pipes / trench design. Spread the trenches at least 25 feet apart if you need multiple trenches, and keep everything at least 4 feet down. That's how to have an efficient system.

In extreme climates, either very heating dominant or very cooling dominant, the system efficiency will go down compared to a nicely balanced load. A correctly done ground exchanger design should take that into account.

If you have cheap fuel available (oil, gas, propane) don't even consider geothermal. But if you are stuck with electric, and want to invest some money now to save it later, it may be worth looking at.

I consider ground water too precious a resource in most areas to think about an open system, but they have a lot of advantages in first cost and constant temperature if you have the water supply. Looking at run time the well pump life may be normal. Think of how much the pump run time changes if you use a couple of gpm / ton the whole time the unit is running.

Geothermal isn't a cure all technology. But it can be a good technology when correctly applied. Get an IGSHPA certified designer and installer and be sure they stick to a proven design. Also, be sure they don't undersize the equipment. An undersized AC unit can't catch up in a heat wave either.

More than enough said.

- J Parker






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 03-05-2004, 23:57 Post: 78965
JParker

TP Contributor

View my Photos

View my Photos  Pics
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Richmond, VA
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 152

Return to Full
 Geothermal heating cooling

Check into local drilling prices for a vertical closed loop system. That's all we do commercially. You're right, I don't think in areas with a deep frost line that you can get a horizontal down deep enough to really be worthwhile unless you put in a lot of pipe.

Still it's more efficient to pull heat out of 35 degree water than 5 degree air.

- JP






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
Reply | Pop Up Window Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


Page [ 1 ] |

Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > Alternate Electric Energy Forum

Thread 78585 Filter by Poster:
DennisCTB 2 | dkheckmanl 1 | HuckMeat 2 | jobone 1 | JParker 2 | kwschumm 6 | Murf 3 | Peters 2 | shortmagnum 5 | toolate 1 |

 (advanced search)

Picture of the Day
candoarms

Landscape Maintenance - Elm Tree Removal Minot North Dakota
Elm Tree Removal Minot North Dakota


Unanswered Questions

Gas Generator Weather Protecti
Horse Injured Polyrope Electri
Do electric fences keep out de
Any Peruvian Paso Owners Out T
gas powered post driver
My new born foal is really sic
Trailer Axle
dump trailer blueprints


Active Subjects

Gas Generator Weather Protecti
Went to see Dennis Reis this w
Signs to look for prior to lab
leg injury
Broodmare has welts all over h
Some Christmas Humor For Horse
poles in the ground vs. concre
ever thought about moving?


Hot Topics

new app owner
Some Christmas Humor For Horse
Any Peruvian Paso Owners Out T
Heating a Garage
Gas Generator Weather Protecti
Do electric fences keep out de
gas powered post driver
Trailer Axle


Featured Suppliers

Mountain Creek Labradoodles
      MountainCreekLabradoodles.com





New Forums on Gun Sport Shooting and Hunting -- BarrelPoint.com  New Forums on Horses ManePoint.com
Talk Horses at ManePoint
Hunting + Gun Sports at BarrelPoint



Most Viewed

+ Windmills for electricity
+ Geothermal heating cooling
+ Solar battery chargers for equipment
+ The Green Fad
+ Air condition is consuming more energy
+ Foundation and PEX instalation

Most Discussion

+ Windmills for electricity
+ Solar battery chargers for equ
+ Geothermal heating cooling
+ The Green Fad
+ Air condition is consuming mor
+ Foundation and PEX instalation

Newest Topics

+ Foundation and PEX instalation
+ Air condition is consuming more energy
+ Solar battery chargers for equipment
+ The Green Fad
+ Windmills for electricity
+ Geothermal heating cooling
















Turbochargers for Tractors and Industrial Machines
Cab Glass for Tractors and Industrial Machines

Alternators for Tractors and Industrial Machines
Radiators for Tractors and Industrial Machines

Driveline Components for Tractors and Industrial Machines
Starter Motors for Tractors and Industrial Machines